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Ben22

I am considering whether I've made the right mov ewith college or not. I know I want to further my education somewhere and get a bachelor's in something, but right now I am at a christian college paying 10K a year (with help; normally its 23K) so I will walk away with 40K of debt minimum. Even worse, the business major I wanted was full, so I went with communications (I was unsure what to major in anyway, I was just picking something because a prof told me going in predeclared sucks and you waste time). I can talk to people alright, but majoring in speech was not a brilliant plan. That doesn't come natural to me like say, working on cars, that sort of thing. I could easily get into Auto Tech school or community college, I just wanted to get a 4 year degree "to make money." BUt everything here is liberal arts, not hands on "engineering" kind of stuff like I am wired for. Is college worth it in the long run if you go to a super-expensive private school, or should I go to a closer state school (there are plenty), so I can pay less and major in something that is more my thing? I got 1740 on my SAT's (new system for grading lol) and I had a 3.8 in HS, so I CAN do this bookworm liberal arts stuff, but it's not my first nature. I've heard this is excellent for developing your mind, but like I said, I want to make $$$ and keep it coming, not be in debt for a decade driving a beat up ford tempo (would NEVER happen, def a honda guy, briansol )

titan22

this is an age old question. getting paid/education/debt/good job vs. something you enjoy more/no debt.

i think your first thought should have been going to a christian school or not. msn has a good article of the value of a degree. if you go to harvard and become a high school teacher, it doesn't really benefit you. but if you want to go into engineering or something technical, a good school will definitely help. you could do what brian did (other mod) and go into programming and make really good money without a 4 year degree. it's all about what you want to do.

i would definitely change your major. something you are interested in doing. if you can't get into it, then i would consider transferring. i went into the air force right after high school. i worked on computer systems in f-16 fighter jets. now i'm a financial advisor. how different are those two things? the point is, i hated what i was doing and went to school. all i needed was the piece of paper saying i have a degree. the more debt you have the more money you need to make with your new profession. but odds are you might make around 40k your first year or two out of college.

people will always argue that you can get a good job with a technical degree. yes, you can make 100k a year as a programmer. but i want to make 500k a year by the time i'm 35. that means i pretty much need (i have it now) a good degree and work my ass off. and it's possible.

you need to decide for yourself how much money you want to make. is it worth it to do something you like a little less and make that money. or would you rather love your job and get paid a little less. or the final option is, find something you love that pays a lot.

oh yeah, i'm a honda guy to. me and brian go on Hondaswap

briansol

College is a touchy subject.

In reality, its just a piece of paper.
But the more you look at it, its not just about learning. It's about rounding out your character.

If you live at home and not on campus, you're not going to get the same experience. To me, that's what college is all about. People, relationships, getting your life together on your own.

After school, a lot depends on your target job.
Me, in the tech field, it's pretty worthless. I DONT have a degree. But getting that first job was a lot harder... But I was able to prove to the company what I could do. Then, I had experience under my belt, and from here on out, i'm golden. It's not what you leanred, its what you can show you've done.

Along the same lines, business, is the complete opposite. IMO, you'll be hard-pressed to get a job worth a damn without an MBA. The bacholors probably will land you a 30-ish salary. which is sad, really.

I would also highly disagree with the going in un-declared.
That's what I did, and I ended up so far behind that I gave up and dropped out. It was the worst piece of advice i have ever gotten.
Had I finished, I would have been there for 6 years for a bacholors, cuz I wasted time taking credits for stuff I couldn't apply towards my new major.
I went in undeclared.
Declared History start of soph year
Changed to IT 2nd semsester of soph year.
the 30 credits of history classes i had were a waste. Half the general ed classes i took wouldn't apply to the IT major, so i'd have to take other versions of it.
I lasted one more year before I said F this, i'm out. I stopped going to class around spring break of my junior year... just lived at school for the last couple months and had a blast.
That more than anything changed me. It gave me drive to do it on my own. I went back home, worked the summer at the restaurant that I had been at since i was 16. by april of the following year, i said F this and quit.
I enrolled myself in a local tech school. 9 month prog to get some networking hands-on. For my internship, I landed a 3rd shift gig that actually paid me well. While working nights, and doing next to nothing, I got a lot of free time to teach myself more coding and stuff. I built hondaswap there for the most part. lol

So, I will leave you with this:
Decide what you like doing. Make a list.

Out of that list, who will pay you to do any of that?

Cross out the ones that you can't see your self doing for life, or don't pay shit.

A buddy of mine is an auto tech, another buddy of mine does construction. They both have bad backs, knees hurt, die in the summer, freeze in the winter... work their asses off. Not to mention the hundreds of thousands of dollars they have to spend on tools. And no, i'm not exagerating that figure. 20 bucks here, 50 there, adds up quick.

I sit at home on a $1000 laptop, in the a/c or heat, type and click, and make twice their salaries, without a degree.

Ben22

yeah nick, I am on HS as well Thank God for Brian and a lot of free time lol
And about the business thing, you seriously have to have a Master's to get respect now? Wtf? I haven't heard anything about this, but I don't run with the business major crowd around here.

briansol

A general business degree will get you a job doing marketing or managing or some shit... something pretty much anyone can do.
If you want to be a high executive of a company, you won't get far without your MBA.
30-45k vs 100k+ salary probably, depending on locale.

For 2 years of school, it makes a big difference.


So again, I encourage you to make a list of things you like.
hell, post that list.

Here's mine.

porn
movies
computers
music


i'll never be a porn star, so scratch that.
i'll never be an actor, so scratch that.
computers... hrm... i can do that
music, the dream of being a rock star is always there (I've been playing guitar for over 12 years) but the reality is that less than 1% makes it, and the rest are poor as hell just trying to get gigs for years. Not exactly a stable job either.... and then there's all the drama involved with the other band members....

so, whats left, computers.

Now, break it down.

What do i do most the day?
browse forums, blogs, myspace, video sites, etc etc...

wow, they all have ads. they must be making money.

yup.


I work full time doing e-commernce now, but my dream is to quit and just run web sites for a living. I know several people who bank 50k+ a MONTH off simple websites such as this. No, i'm not kidding.

I don't expect this site to ever be my bread and butter, but with enough sites in a network, its more than possible.

Simply put, if i wanted to, I could sell everything I have, buy an f150, and move to east bunghole Kentucky in some trailer park and never have to work again and live the rest of my life off of what I have going for me right now.

I don't want that lifestyle though, so I continue to work my real job, plus spend 5+ hours a day on my side projects in hopes that one day I can do the same, but not have to move to a trailer park in kentucky. I'd like to stay in CT, drive my M3, and live in my condo, or even better, a new house in a couple years. So, I constantly work towards it. And Hopefully, before I'm 30, that dream will be a reality.

Recruit your friends

titan22

the important part of education is to have that stupid piece of paper. it doesn't really matter so much what in, just as long as you have it. i mean, if you want to go into business obviously you would want a business degree. i have a friend, who for some reason got a zoology degree, makes 60k as a manager of an office that has a bunch of high school kids making those annoying telemarketing calls.

find something you really enjoy, and find a way to make money off of it. if money is more important, find a job that you can just barely stand and be good at it.

Ben22

My skills are this:
1) I have a locksmith level knowledge of locks, or at least I did, I'm sure some of it is fading. Watched too much MacGyver and decided to read a million books on how to do that stuff, now I can open damn near anything. But unfortunately locksmiths make crap, and that's also something you don't go bragging to people. You say "I can pick locks" and they hear "I am a thief" :\

2) Drumming. I am probably a rock star level drummer, I've played a ton since I was 3 with a LOT of different groups, but music majors make shit, and hitting it big in a band is hardly something I am willing to bank my future on. (On you siad)

3) Cars. Don't think so lol.

4) I like computers, I am proficient, but I know nothing about programming, I just use windows and programs.

5) Construction. I have done a little here and there with my dad, basic remodeling and stuff, helping with church HVAC, etc. but this pays lousy too.

6) Guns, but again, gunsmiths make jack. And that's not the best pick up like, "Yeah, so I make a living selling guns."

Basically, I have one of those analytical, how-does-this-work? kind of minds, but I am not so hot at math which makes engineering a stretch. I made it through alg I &II and geometry in HS, but it didn't come naturally. Geometry was far easier for me though.

so
locksmith
drummer
mechanic
IT
construction
guns
engineering???

So, for the two that actually pay decent: IT and engineering
Now I guess I will just see what happens with the personality/skills test I took yesterday at the "center for life calling and leadership" here on campus.

Ben22

The big thing I don't want to be like all of my ancestos and live paycheck to paycheck. I see there are some things on here about investing, is it possible to invest smaller amounts of moeny and it still be worthwhile? I've heard even working calss people can invest and come out as ahead as people who went to college if they do it right.

titan22

i have several clients that don't have big salaries. but they live within their budgets and they live modestly. if you have a job that pays 50k a year, you don't have the luxury of having a $400,000 house and a $50,000 car. you just live with what you have. if you don't want to have a lot of college debt, transfer. it's as easy as that. there are a lot of public schools that are a lot cheaper and you get just as good of an education. the key is, get that stupid piece of rice paper and ink. that's all that matters. there are a million jobs out that only care if you have it.

if you feel that you don't want to waste the time and effort, do what brian did. get a technical degree. they both make good money, but experience counts a lot if you get a tech. degree. if i was you, i would just play around on Monster Jobs - Get work. Network. Build a better career. Today's the day. and see if there are any jobs that sound interesting. then see what the requirements are. you can put in a pay scale that you are interested in and they are all organized for you. do your research but don't get frustrated and just quit. that is the worst thing you could do.

briansol

It's not how much you make--- it's how much you spend.

You can live off 2000 a month. And thats comfortable.

1000 for mortgage on a small place, 300 for a modest car, and 700 for other bills, food, gas, etc.
at an old job at 45k a year, i was taking home (after taxes) 2300 a month... so that was well within my means to bank a couple hundred a month.
200 x 12 = 2400 a year
it sounds like nothing, but compounded over time, that 2.5k you bank a year adds up, plus re-curring interest on it
if you can get 5% (which is NOT unreasnable... hell, paypal is paying more than that right now) you can put away a good amount of money over time. here's 2 charts, one 10 year, one 25 year, both assuming 5% return, and putting only 2500 a year. The Green (compound) is the goal. You can see over 10 years, its not much. But on 25 years, it starts to grow... and grows exponetially.

If you were to live for 100 more years, and did the 2500 a year thing, you'd have 5 million.... but you'd be 120 yrs old. lol
But 2500 is really nothing... a couple hundred a month... don't eat out 4 times a month if you eat out a lot, and there you go.

The more you put in up front, the more the additional earnings add up. Thats why its more important for us younger guys to start now. If you're 30 and don't have an investment plan, you're going to have to work twice as hard as a 25 year old. Just 5 years of saving turns out to be almost double the earnings over a 30 year term. Start now. Even if its 200 a month. even if its 100 a month. ANYTHING is better than nothing.

Assuming you're 20, you have 45 years before reitrement at 65.

In the last attachment, I assume 2500 the first year, then 10 grand each year after.
This is skewed, because you probably won't be able to put 10k away a year for a while, and once your house is paid for, you'll be able to put a lot more away.... or even off the equity earned in your house over time.

But, 2 mil is plenty IMO for a 20-year retirement (assuming you live to 85). thats 100k a year, before taxes.

of course, this isn't accounting for inflation either... the more inflation goes up, the less your money is actually worth, hence the dip

Play with this tool a little bit (requires java)
Growth Calculator

Attached Images

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	25yrs_2500.gif (16.2 KB, 1 views)
	45yrs_2500.gif (15.4 KB, 2 views)